Mormon/LDS ? Did ANYONE besides Joesph Smith see the golden plates where are they supposed to be?......?
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Anti charge:\n\n...when questioned closely the witnesses said they never really saw the gold plates except when they were wrapped up or covered. They used terms like “vision” or “I saw them with the eye of faith.” ...Of these eleven total witnesses, over half apostatized from the Mormon church.... Joseph Smith and other Mormon officials are on record as calling his three main witnesses “thieves and liars.” In History of the Church Joseph Smith said, “Such characters as ... David Whitmer, Oliver Cowdery, and Martin Harris, are too mean to mention, and we would like to have forgotten them.” (McElveen, 48-49.)\n\nThe testimony of the Book of Mormon witnesses (Martin Harris, Oliver Cowdery, and David Whitmer) has been a thorn in the side of the critics for more than a century and a half (read this testimony). Many critics have tried to ignore their testimonies, while others have simply glossed over their significance. Those who have attempted to tackle the issue generally have relied on ad hominem arguments– attacking the credibility, honesty, or motives of the Three Witnesses.\n\nWhat possible motives might have driven the Three Witnesses to proclaim (and maintain) their testimonies? It is important to keep in mind that these three men never denied their testimonies. Throughout their entire lives they claimed that an angel of God had shown them the Book of Mormon plates. Trying times arose in each of their lives– persecution, loss of financial gains, etc. Each of these men separated themselves from the Mormon Church at some point in their lives for one reason or another. Some may think this shows that neither the Book of Mormon, nor the LDS Church are true. On the contrary, we point out the significance of the departure of the faith by these three men because despite their loss of membership, they continued to affirm their testimonies of the Book of Mormon. Both Martin Harris and Oliver Cowdery rejoined the Church at later dates, but although David Whitmer did not, he maintained to his death that his testimony was true. Think of the significance. Despite excommunicate, embarrassment, and ill-feelings, these men knew they had seen an angel; they knew they had heard a voice from heaven declaring the book’s authenticity; and they knew that the Book of Mormon was the word of God.\n\nSome may wonder why any of these witnesses could ever leave or be excommunicated from the Mormon Church. All men make mistakes, and these men were no different. The times in which these men lived were trying times, times when persecution against the Mormons was severe, to say the least. Did not Judas betray Christ? Judas, an Apostle chosen by the Lord himself? Are we to conclude therefore that Christianity is a fraud? Did not Peter deny Christ three times? Peter, who was the chief Apostle, and an Apostle who performed great works both during and after Christ’s ministry? Did not King David fall from favor in the eyes of God due to his sins?\n\nAs I see it, there are five possible motives for proclaiming their testimony, and possible motives for maintaining their testimonies.\n\nPossible Motives for Proclaiming Their Testimonies\n1) Wealth– If the Book of Mormon were to become a best seller, they might see lucrative returns by falsely testifying to have seen the angel and plates. Perhaps they even thought they would start an organization by which they could con thousands of people out of their money.\n\n2) Fame– The Three Witnesses might have hoped that people the world over would have been impressed by their false testimonies and might have shown them the adulation reserved for royalty.\n\n3) Power– Tied to both wealth and fame, the Three Witnesses might have falsely testified in hopes of gaining power of other people. Such power might secure them financially for the rest of their lives.\n\n4) Duped– They might have been duped by Joseph Smith or their own fantasies. Perhaps Joseph Smith was such a brilliant con artist that h
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Me.\n\nBtw, I saw you on another board. I'm in SLC, too. Mormon?
683403
A. \nand it's Mormons... yah...
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I believe you to be true in what your saying.\nYou seem to me like a christian. I find demons to be in mormons. I find them to stick together like a cult group as well. They have hard time figuring out what is real and what is correct. Have you noticed that non member is always corrected even when you join "you get corrected".\nLike that other girl said For some reason like other post of yours you seem to know alot about mormons. \nTalking to the mormon lady who spoke up  well so what if he does! Do you want convert him cause you lose people more and more everyday! Wake up silly mormon tricks are from  the \ndevil not from God. Real christians know that mormons dont live the way God says in the bible. Real christians know that mormons have to have there way. Real christians also know you dont go by a cross you go by a spare that sticks straight up. Nothing you can say can change a christ follower thats "christ", no one else shall i follow, but christ. As a christian follows a true christian knows they can not do works to get there self in to heaven. By the way there is only one heaven and one hell. Sorry that i had to be the one to tell you the true truth.
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I'm a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, I can tell you. Members of the LDS Church (that's the prefered term, though most know us as "Mormons") believe that Joseph Smith, at the age of fourteen, was searching for God's church on the Earth. After looking into so many, he was a bit confused and asked the Bible. He read in the book of James, Chapter 1, verse 5, that: "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not, and it shall be given him." Continuing on in verse 6, it says: "But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering•. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed." Reading this, Joseph wanted a quiet place to pray, so he went into  a grove of trees, where he knelt to pray. He asked God to tell him which church was His, which church to join.In the Joseph Smith History, it speaks of this account: "After I had retired to the place where I had previously designed to go, having looked around me, and finding myself alone, I kneeled down and began to offer up the desires of my heart to God. I had scarcely done so, when immediately I was seized upon by some power which entirely overcame me, and had such an astonishing influence over me as to bind my tongue so that I could not speak. Thick darkness gathered around me, and it seemed to me for a time as if I were doomed to sudden destruction.\n\nBut, exerting all my powers to call upon God to deliver me out of the power of this enemy which had seized upon me, and at the very moment when I was ready to sink into despair and abandon myself to destruction—not to an imaginary ruin, but to the power of some actual being from the unseen world, who had such marvelous power as I had never before felt in any being—just at this moment of great alarm, I saw a pillar of light exactly over my head, above the brightness of the sun, which descended gradually until it fell upon me.\n\nIt no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!\n \nMy object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.\n\nI was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all awrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”\n\nHe again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother, “I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.” It seems as though the adversary was aware, at a very early period of my life, that I was destined to prove a disturber and an annoyer of his kingdom; else why should the powers of darkness combine against me? Why the opposition and persecution that arose against me, almost in my infancy?"\n\n\nI hope that ans
1008786
mormons again ? really
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It's all right here (even their whole catalog):\n\nhttp://www.ldsvideo.com/ind.htm
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I was married to a mormon once, and her daddy was a bishop.  For her sake I tried to validate mormonism, but Joseph Smith was a lying con artist who victimized the weak and ignorant.  This is based on the mormons version of the mormon history.\n\nBeyond that, their doctrine is a perversion of Biblical truth on almost every point of their doctrine.
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I love Mormons. Probably because I am one though. Keep up the good fight! \nFor REAL answers concerning the Mormon Church (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints), please visit the following:\n\nhttp://www.mormon.org\nhttp://www.lds.org\nhttp://www.fairlds.org\nhttp://ldsfaq.byu.edu/\n\nThanks, and have a wonderful day!
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I am a christian and i dont belive that Joseph smith is a true prophet of God. Nor do i believe that the lds church is christian. Since they belive in earning them selfes in heaven. Just ask them, this is what they belive. There is no eternal marriage Jesus said there is no reason for it that is why we have a marriage till death do you part. Speaking as a true christian and not as other.
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OK, I'm a Mormon (convert of ten years) and am amazed at the level of ignorance shown here. Here's how it really is:\n\nWe DO NOT believe that God had sex with Mary. (Pernicious falsehood started by anti-Mormons)\n\nWe DO believe "that Jesus is Lord and that He died on the cross and he rose from the dead on the third day". [c.f. "Jesus_is_awesome"]\n\nWe believe that Jesus and satan are spirit brothers ONLY IN THE SENSE that everyone and everything, even satan, are created by God. People created by the same father are brothers.\n\nWe DO believe in salvation by grace, and we DO NOT believe that our good works save us. However, when we confess faith in Jesus Christ we promise to follow him. "If ye love me, keep my commandments". Our works are what show that He is Lord of our lives. If we deliberately fail to live according to his will we cannot really have meant that prayer. (But we know we can repent when we make a mistake.)\n\nI recently asked "What must I do to be saved?" I had 33 answrs, all of which said something along the lines of "Accept Jesus Christ and repent of your sins." I have done that, therefore I am saved and going to heaven. I also happen to be a Mormon.
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How about the out and out contraditions?  Here they are...\nBible and Book of Mormon Contradictions\n\nBy Sandra Tanner\n\n1.The Bible plainly states that the gospel, with its inclusion of Gentiles, was not fully revealed until after Christ's death. \nEph. 3:3-7 Paul writes "by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel: whereof I was made a minister ...... (See also Col. 1:26; 1 Peter 1: 1-12; Romans 16:25-26)\n\nHowever, the Book of Mormon maintains that this knowledge was had in 545 B.C.\n2 Nephi 25:19 "For according to the words of the prophets, the Messiah cometh... his name shall be Jesus Christ, the Son of God. ... (v.23) For we labor... to persuade... our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.\n2 Nephi 26:12 "And as I spake concerning the convincing of the Jews, that Jesus in the very Christ, it must needs be that the Gentiles be convinced also that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God;"\n2 Nephi 30:3 "For behold, I say unto you that as many of the Gentiles as will repent are the covenant people of the Lord; and as many of the Jews as will not repent shall be cast off,"\n2 Nephi 31:17 "For the gate by which ye should enter is repentance and baptism by water; and then cometh a remission of your sins by fire and the Holy Ghost."\n\n2.During Jesus' ministry He spoke of His church as something in the future. \nMatthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."\nAfter Christ's resurrection and the day of Pentecost we read "And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved." (Acts 2:47)\n\nHowever, the Book of Mormon claims the Christian church was established as early as 147 B.C.\nMosiah 18:17 "And they were called the church of God, or the church of Christ, from that time forward."\n\n3.The Bible says believers were first called Christians after Paul's ministry in Antioch. \nActs 11:26 "And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."\n\nHowever, the Book of Mormon claims people were known by this title as early as 73 B.C.\nAlma 46:15 "...yea, all those who were true believes in Christ took upon them, gladly, the name of Christ, or Christians as they were called, because of their belief in Christ who should come."\n\n4.The Holy Ghost was bestowed on the Christians at the time of Pentecost. \nLuke 24:49 "And, behold, I send the promise of my Father unto you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high."\nActs 2:1-4 "And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. ... And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost,..."\n\nYet the Book of Mormon claims that people received the gift of the Holy Ghost as early as 545 B.C.\n2 Nephi 31:12-13 "...the voice of the Son came unto me, saying: He that is baptized in my name, to him will the Father give the Holy Ghost, like unto me... Wherefore, my beloved brethren,... by following your Lord and your Savior down into the water, according to his word, behold, then shall ye receive the Holy Ghost; yea, then cometh the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost;..."\n\n5.In the Old Testament the only ones who could be priests were the descendants of Levi, one of the twelve sons of Israel. \nNumbers 3:9
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From a Mormon point of view I would say God the Father and Jesus Christ were definitely there. Since we are all children of God, I believe that we were also in the same pre-mortal realm, although we did not have the same creative authority as they have. However, it would not be outside the bounds of imagination to say that God and Jesus Christ organized intelligent spirits to help with smaller aspects of the creation. Those would be both male AND female spirits, including any angels who had that capacity to serve. Perhaps you have lived in a community where an elementary school was being built to further the education of children of new families who had moved into the area. If you can apply that idea further, perhaps that is what was going on in the pre-earth life - we all had a chance to see what was going on and support God and Jesus Christ. As children of God, we would resemble our Heavenly Parents (in their image), just as children on earth resemble their physical parents. We are part of the race of gods, but we are passing through a mortal stage right now to keep learning about physical and spiritual laws. This is just my opinion, but it is based on a smaller book of scripture called the Pearl of Great Price we use in addition to the Bible and the Book of Mormon (because after all, who wants to limit an author to just one book, and we can't limit God if He wishes to teach His children in other lands).
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There is quite an elaborate and wonderful story that mormons relate about the native americans.  I don't know if they are right, but it sure is interesting and probably one of the kinder forms of christianity that I've seen.  You should read some of their stuff, it's not bad!\n\nbtw:  if they are right... I will be in the terrestial kingdom (third level heaven) with all my friends... picture bourbon street!\n\nNot a bad option!
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I'm LDS, and I'm proud!  \nI have been looking around a bit, and I think that the lies that are posted are outragous!  I mean, if someone asks a question about us LDS people, how about you let US LDS people answer them?  We are the ones who live the religion (it's not a cult, and we don't have communes, etc.), and we are the ones who go to church each week.  Most of the sites that people are reffering to are full of lies!  It's sickening.  If anybody wants to know what we REALLY believe, you can go to www.mormon.ORG, or www.lds.ORG.  Check your facts with LDS people folks, not quasi-religious polygamist cults using the name of our church.
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True mormons dont just have one God but everyone who did there study on the early mormon church would find it was and had nothing to do with joseph smith the word mormon came from \nthe Amazonians. Look it up on the net the true nature of the mormon existence was about women it always has been and always well. The men know this who are very high up they just dont care anymore. Some of them do and leave but the mormons dont just have greek mythology in there the dumb butt PUT   Egyptian IDOLS and had no idea what he was getting himself into, but hey everyone knows that is not a mormon brainwashed idiot? That joseph smith had a degree in the craft and was spotted with anne lee who belived to be the christ in recarnation so go figure.
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As usual, the so eloquently named EATGIZZ and I differ.  I AM A MORMON.  Are Mormons Christian? YES!! Latter-day Saints believe in Christ as the Savior, the Redeemer, the Son of God, the Creator of the earth, and the only source of salvation. It is His love and grace that give meaning to life and hope to humanity. We believe in the Bible, which plainly teaches that Christ is our Savior and that all men must repent and come unto Christ to be saved. Some critics proclaim that Mormons are not Christians and don't believe in Christ. I really don't like other people telling me what I believe! As a Latter-day Saint, I have been taught, and have personally chosen, to accept Christ as my Savior. I am taught to follow Him, to rely on His love, and to feast on His word. I know that real Mormons are Christians. We worship Christ and covenant to follow Him. We are baptized in His name to follow Him, we partake of the sacrament (the holy communion) weekly to remember the sacrifice of His blood and to remember His victory over death, we pray to the Father in His name, and we strive to obey Him, knowing that it is only through His merits and grace that we are saved. He is constantly held up in our meetings as our Savior, our Redeemer, our Lord, and the author of our faith and our salvation. We believe that He stands at the head of His living Church, leading it as in days of old through revelation to His prophets and apostles. The Christ we worship is the living Christ, the Son of God, foretold in the Old Testament, revealed in the New Testament, and affirmed in The Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ.